marie claire sucks

[mickeym]

By way of annella:

Who wants to see fat people in love? Not Marie Claire.

That is a link to a discussion of an article in fucking MARIE CLAIRE about how disgusting fat people are. Like Elle said in her post, I'm not linking to the article; it's easy enough to find it, and I don't want to encourage traffic to their site.

Here's an excerpt from the article: So anyway, yes, I think I’d be grossed out if I had to watch two characters with rolls and rolls of fat kissing each other … because I’d be grossed out if I had to watch them doing anything. To be brutally honest, even in real life, I find it aesthetically displeasing to watch a very, very fat person simply walk across a room — just like I’d find it distressing if I saw a very drunk person stumbling across a bar or a heroine addict slumping in a chair.

(I particularly like that the anti!fat writer misspelled 'heroin'.)



I feel...anger and sorrow at this. At the attitude toward obesity in general. There are so many reasons why people are overweight: genetic factors, emotional factors, health things like thyroid or blood sugar. For some it's a combination of things.

I weigh somewhere in the area of 430lbs right now. I am -- and probably always will be, to some degree -- one of those people that the author is talking about not wanting to see sharing affection/being intimate because of the gross factor. And it's attitudes LIKE hers that make me not want to step foot outside my house because I'm likely to be one of the heaviest people in any gathering. I don't want to open myself up for emotional hurt. I had more than enough experiences growing up of being called "fatty" and "fatso", and being picked last for kickball. I had to endure comments when I was older about how it must suck that my stomach sticks out further than my boobs. Whispers that followed me if I went into a store by myself.

Right now it's hard enough to make myself go outside and walk, move, whatever. It's physically painful and difficult, and it would be really easy to give up trying. It would be nice to think that when I do go out that if I'm being judged by anyone it's for what I'm saying or doing. That I'm judged for ME and not my appearance.

I know that's not the case. I am painfully aware that that's not the case. No doubt I've lost job opportunities because someone didn't want to hire someone who's obviously morbidly obese. I know there are people who feel obesity somehow affects intelligence, and that I'm probably being judged as stupid. There are days, depending on my mood and how my self-esteem is at that particular moment, I'd probably agree with them.

My husband left me for someone who is tall and slender--and dumb as a rock.

I HATE that there is so much attention paid to what people look like. The emphasis on being thin and "gorgeous" that's everywhere, in all forms of media.

I have as much right as anyone else to kiss whom I want wherever I want. If I'm losing weight, it's not because I'm trying to spare someone's delicate sensibilities. It's because I want to be healthier over all, for me. If I choose NOT to lose weight, that's also my decision, and if I have someone to kiss I will do so in public if I want...and if it bothers whoever might be looking, well. Don't look. It's your problem, not mine.

Comments

[locknkey.livejournal.com]

Damn - you know I hate this shit - we talked about it some.

You are beautiful, hon and It was such a pleasure to get to know you better. :) You are also, smart and strong and loving and I am so so blessed that I was able to see you in person - it made it that much better. :)

I've never met a woman who was entirely happy with her appearance and I think articles like this have a lot to answer for.

I'd so much rather see any two people kiss in public than subject myself to the kind of poison words like this promote.

::hugs you tight::

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

*hugs you back* Thank you :) Getting to meet you was the highpoint of my week. My month. (I told Matthew that you're a little bitty person -- he's over 6' now -- and he said, "a pocket person!" *g*) I wish Cali wasn't so far away from Kentucky. :(

[raynedanser.livejournal.com]

Oh wow, that is truly truly terrible to think, let alone think it was ok to publish. How revolting.

And you know what else? I would send them a letter saying the exact thing you said here. They need to know that was a horrible line they crossed.

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

I'm still trying to figure out how it made it past editors and stuff. I mean, they do editing, don't they? *shakes head*

I am just so sick and tired of discrimination on all sides. For weight, for appearance, for sexual orientation, for religion. This world we live in makes me sad and tired.

[gooferdusty.livejournal.com]

i have no words for this. it seems to me that discrimination against overweight people is somehow seen as ok. This whole thing makes me sad, is love only for the slim and beautiful?

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

is love only for the slim and beautiful?

The slim, the beautiful, and the heterosexual, apparently. *sigh*

[zillahseye.livejournal.com]

I lost respect for Marie Claire in 2001 when they printed an "I'M GAY!" cover about Justin Timberlake and it turned out to be an out-of-context quote where he was denying it. If you'll out someone when it's a lie, you'd out someone when it was true. Doing either lumps you with asswipe tabloids on the end of supermarket aisles. But replacing actual content from an interviewee in favor of something you decided was "scandalous" is even lower than working for a tabloid, because tabloids don't take up their victim's time in good faith. They're honest thieving scum.

ETA: Not that it's any excuse to be an ass in public, and she surely had editors who approved her message, but I have a LITTLE more understanding for the Marie Claire writer now that I see at that link you left that she's in recovery for an eating disorder. Depending how "recovered" you are, that type of thing can leave a blinding chunk of pathology in your brain.

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

I can understand if you're in recovery for an eating disorder. BUT that doesn't make it okay to write something that's going to be seen by millions, saying that seeing two fat people kiss is disgusting.

I might've had sympathy if she'd state up front in her article that she had issues she was working through, or whatever. But, as you said, depending on how "recovered" you are, it can leave a blinding chunk of pathology in your brain. It left one in mine, last night. I spent most of the rest of the evening wanting to eat anything and everything I could get my hands on, feeling anxious and distressed and upset.

I didn't binge, and I did end up doing a brain dump of emotion into a journal entry, and it helped. But yeah. The whole thing was upsetting to an extreme degree.

[zillahseye.livejournal.com]

BLEH. *hugs* Yeah, and from what a few commenters said she's done the whole "Oh gosh, I'm so sorry, did I do that?" thing with the apology before. What a loser.

[munibunny.livejournal.com]

Ah, well, you know most of us have weight issues of varying degrees so you're not alone in the way you feel. Just don't give up because some small minded individuals decided to call attention to themselves. You're an amazing woman... and you're doing fantastic job holding it together. Don't let this shit get you down!

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

well, it got me down, but I worked through it. Thanks for the support, honey. *hugs you*

[kitanabychoice.livejournal.com]

I saw this come up on my facebook feed today. Marie Claire strikes again with the terrible size related articles. My first reaction to that article was, "You don't like Mike and Molly? Change the fucking channel."

What's even more killer is that the article author one struggled with anorexia and body issues, which is in the same freaking boat really. That woman has some incredible nerve.

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

As I was telling Nic up above, I might've had some sympathy and understanding for the author had she stated upfront that she was in recovery for an eating disorder and body issues, and that it colored her opinions/perceptions. I could understand that, though it still doesn't justify her saying what she did, knowing it's going to be read by millions.

I spent the rest of last night anxious and upset, wanting to eat my way through the house. I didn't, I did some journaling, instead, and it helped. But ugh.

[gestaltrose.livejournal.com]

*glomps you*

From one big woman to another I think you're fantastic and my heroine... not heroin... although you can be addicting.

I am fat, sexy, and lovable and I will kiss whomever I damn well please (as long as they're consenting) whenever and wherever I want to... and if they don't like it they can kiss my big fat ass.

*hugs, sneaky gropes and very obvious kisses* *with tongue*

*leaves laughing*

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

*hugs back* *smooches*

Thank you, honey. YOU are awesome :)

[gretazreta.livejournal.com]

You're beautiful and so strong.
<3

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

Thank you, honey :) *hugs you*

[zillahseye.livejournal.com]

I did go search for the article, and she put in an ETA (too little, too late, I'm sure many people will say, but she did acknowledge her own eating disorder issues as warping her judgment.) I'm putting the whole thing here since you didn't want the article linked.

UPDATE: I would really like to apologize for the insensitive things I've said in this post. Believe it or not, I never wanted anyone to feel bullied or ashamed after reading this, and I sorely regret that it upset people so much. A lot of what I said was unnecessary; it wasn't productive, either.




I know a lot of people truly struggle to lose weight— for medical and psychological reasons—and that many people have an incredibly difficult time getting to a healthy size. I feel for those people and I'm truly sorry I added to the unhappiness and pain they feel with my post.




I would like to reiterate that I think it's great to have people of all shapes and healthy sizes represented in magazines (as, it bears mentioning here, they are in Marie Claire) and on TV shows--and that in my post, I was talking about a TV show that features people who are not simply a little overweight, but appear to be morbidly obese. (Morbid obesity is defined as 100% more than their ideal weight.) And for whatever it's worth, I feel just as uncomfortable when I see an anorexic person as I do when I see someone who is morbidly obese, because I assume people suffering from eating disorders on either end of the spectrum are doing damage to their bodies, and that they are unhappy. But perhaps I shouldn’t be so quick to judge based on superficial observations.



To that point (and on a more personal level), a few commenters and one of my friends mentioned that my extreme reaction might have grown out of my own body issues, my history as an anorexic, and my life-long obsession with being thin. As I mentioned in the ongoing dialogue we’ve been carrying on in the comments section, I think that's an accurate insight.



People have accused me of being a bully in my post; I never intended to be that--it's actually the very last thing I want to be, as a writer or a person. But I know that I came off that way, and I really cannot apologize enough to the people whom I upset.

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

I do appreciate that she apologized, but I hope she understands now the power of words, and the damage they can do.

[leighm.livejournal.com]

It's a very superficial thing. We're a melting pot of shape and size and that only scratches the surface of who people really are.

I quit caring what anyone thought about whether they liked the way I looked a while ago. All that matters are the people who love you and will always back you up. That's what counts! Society has ruined us as far as looks go. Everything is airbrushed on a page. Hello, all women have cellulitis, lol. So?

♥

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

I wish I could quit caring what people thought. I hope I'll get there someday. But stuff like that magazine article make it very difficult :(

*hugs you*

[ms-nerd.livejournal.com]

I read that on Jezebel (http://jezebel.com/5673680/what-was-marie-claire-thinking-with-this-fatties-piece) and I was flabbergasted.

This writer sucks. People aren't stupid or gross because they are fat. THIN DOES NOT AUTOMATICALLY EQUAL HEALTHY OR SEXY!!

You know what phrase we have to eliminate MORBIDLY OBESE. It is an offensive term that suggests people are walking around diseased and gloomy. That phrase totally pisses me off and I think the "doctors" the diet industry pays came up with that phrase to scare people into thinking they are horrible people because they are fat. Well fuck them. Oh, I am so mad, I'm so sorry.

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

The thing I hate the most is that people look at someone who's overweight and automatically judges that person as weak-willed, with no self-control. Thin doesn't equal healthy or sexy, and I don't think they're any more or less strong-willed or in control than anyone else. I don't know. *sigh*

[ms-nerd.livejournal.com]

http://jezebel.com/5675725/if-youre-fat+phobic-youre-also-an-ignorant-bigoted-idiot

exactly!!!! sorry i have baby in one arm - can't do fancy link.

[fpvs.livejournal.com]

planning to read your whole entry at home, but there is a new show in the US - mike and molly. Look it up. I have the eps. It's real good.

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

I'm not a big fan of sit-coms, but thank you for the rec :)

[rahaeli.livejournal.com]

I think you're beautiful and brainy and one of the most generous and caring people I know. And if I haven't said it lately, I admire the hell out of you for everything you're doing to make your life better for you, from the weight loss to the going-back-to-school. Because you rock. ♥

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

*clings* I'm not feeling terribly awesome or anything, but thank you :) *hugs tight* (And I'm about to answer your email--sorry, I wasn't on much earlier today.)

[rahaeli.livejournal.com]

No worries, babe! There's no rush. :)

Part 1

[sangre-fria.livejournal.com]

This is absolutely appalling, and I refuse to sit back and let this bullshit carry on.

I've made my utter disgust for this article known on both my journal (http://sangre-fria.livejournal.com/82615.html) and through an email directly to Marie Claire's editor in chief:

Dear Ms. Coles,

I'm writing in regards to an article posted yesterday on MarieClaire.com entitled 'Should "Fatties" Get a Room? (Even on TV?)', written by Maura Kelly. I'm sure you've already received plenty of emails like this one, but I feel that the point bears repeating.

I was horribly offended by both the chosen diction and overall message of that article. Not because I feel personally attacked by it, but because it is one of the most deplorable things I have ever read. It showed a gross lack of sensitivity and maturity; it was mean, petty, and wholly lacking in any kind of substance. The entire point and purpose of the article was to point a finger at a group of people and go "Eww, eww, eww!" like an elementary school bully. This is the exact opposite of what publishable journalism should be, and I highly doubt that this kind of behavior is what you would like to become synonymous with your magazine.

I am not a usual reader of Marie Claire magazine; in fact, this article is my first impression of it. A scathing and disgusted discussion of this article appeared on the friends' page of my online network of choice, which I then followed back to its source at MarieClaire.com. Many of the people involved in that discussion have posted about it as well, which is spreading the word like wildfire. By tomorrow, hundreds (if not thousands) more people will be viewing and condemning the utter rot that your magazine has published. Media organizations are beginning to recognize the power of the Internet in this way; one terrible mistake like this can be heard around the world within hours, and I think that you should take more care in deciding what is published on your watch.

Part 2

[sangre-fria.livejournal.com]

The update to the article, which issued an "apology", was so woefully inadequate that I could only shake my head. Maura Kelly's "apology" consisted of backpedaling like mad one moment ("...I would like to reiterate that I think it's great to have people of all shapes and healthy sizes represented in magazines..."), and then trying to justify what she had previously said by revealing that she herself has struggled with body issues in the past ("...my extreme reaction might have grown out of my own body issues, my history as an anorexic, and my life-long obsession with being thin..."). Sorry; even a sincere and heart-felt apology would be hard pressed to "fix" the debacle caused by the original article, and this certainly doesn't cut it.

This entire affair merely serves to reiterate the stereotype that fashion and/or teen magazines reinforce an unhealthy body image in young women. This incident almost feels like a behind-the-scenes look at how your magazine is run. Should I assume that all of Marie Claire's columnists are former anorexics, or is Maura Kelly the exception that just slipped through the cracks? I'm not condemning her for her past illness, but rather how she is letting those unhealthy behaviors color her writing about current issues. In light of her past struggles with her body, perhaps Maura Kelly was not the right person to choose for an article about the perception of obesity in the media; don't you think? Ms. Kelly herself admits "...I'm not much of a TV person...", and that she needed to be steered toward the CNN article before beginning her assignment. Clearly, in more that one respect, she was not the ideal blogger for this topic.

And in light of the current national focus on bullying, and the incredibly harmful effects that even verbal bullying can have on a person, this article will receive even more scrutiny than ever before. I would suggest that your columnists and bloggers be made especially aware of the effect that their words can have, and the potential backlash that can result when they don't choose them thoughtfully and kindly.

As for Ms. Kelly herself, I hope I never have to see her name again, let alone read another article. I know that this opinion is deeply biased by my current feelings (and the fact that a brief perusal of her articles only turned up the kind of shallow, mindless dross that I've come to associate with the worst kind of teen magazines: "How to Decide If He's Right For You", "5 Ways to Tell if He's Just Not That into You", "Sure Signs a Guy's a Player", etc.), so I don't feel that I could make a reasonable recommendation as to how to handle her as an employee in the aftermath of this incident.

Well....Actually, the recommendation would be very reasonable, but it would also be very petty and spiteful. And I'm sure that Marie Claire magazine doesn't conduct its business on the basis of pettiness and spite. Perhaps someone should send Maura Kelly that memo, if you choose to continue employing her.

Best regards,
Cassondra ------

Re: Part 2

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

That is an incredibly awesome letter. YOU are incredibly awesome. Thank you for sharing it here (and I hope you get a response from them!).

Re: Part 2

[sangre-fria.livejournal.com]

I hate to say it, but I'm definitely not holding my breath for a response. Apparently, Joanna Coles has already issued a public statement, and decided to stand behind the abominable trash that Maura Kelly was spewing. My instinctive response?



It's actually a wonder that my email to her wasn't just pure obscenity delivered with the full force of my capslock.

On the other hand, some really beautiful things have been brought to my attention by this:



On a more personal note, I'd like to take a moment to just say that I admire you so much. Sure, I may not know you personally; yeah, I'm a complete stranger. But you know what? I know you enough to know that you're AMAZING. If I had the kind of writing talent that you have, I could die happy tomorrow.

And I would gladly break my hand on the face of anyone who tries to imply that the world isn't a better place because you're in it. ♥

[maerhysetc.livejournal.com]

I hate Marie Claire, although I know that they are not the only ones who think this (or even publish it), although the mention of Elle and MC make me think there is a Nina Garcia connection to this. I digress.

I could write a novel on weight and self-esteem (and even self-efficacy) but I'll leave it at I empathize so much and anyone who doesn't give you a chance is fucking themselves over and they don't deserve the pleasure of your company.

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

Thank you. *hugs* I hate that society is so hung up on appearance, rather than judging someone on their actions or words -- and I hate that it hurts so many of us. Ugh.

[quiet000001.livejournal.com]

Doug left because he's an idiot. Don't be hiding any "if only I was thinner/taller he wouldn't have..." thoughts in your head. *eyes you suspiciously*

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

Yeah, Doug left because he's an idiot, and I'm not hiding any "if only I was thinner" thoughts, I promise. But my weight was an issue for him. He didn't harp on it constantly, but he made comments every so often so that I was aware of it.

And, again, he went for someone who is like a mirror opposite of me (in every way, seriously). *shrugs* Anyway.

[quiet000001.livejournal.com]

Idiot! More proof!

[fleshflutter.livejournal.com]

♥ ♥ ♥ ♥

I have been obese and I have been thin, and it has never ever been anybody else's business but mine.

[mickeym.livejournal.com]

I feel that way, too (though I'm not sure I've ever been thin). Unfortunately there are lots of people who think it's their business. Eventually, maybe, I'll get to a point where it doesn't bother me.

*hugs you*

[jeeronie.livejournal.com]

I don't see why the weight of someone should be of importance to anyone but themselves. It's bad if people don't feel good and struggle with it as is with any other personal problem you may have trouble with but unless you are a friend or a professional trying to help the person I don't see what you have to do with it.

On a petty note: what would someone like her think if I said I find it disgusting when I see prejudiced people kissing?

Also, kudos for your strength in losing weight, I hope you get to where you feel good, rooting for you.

[fufaraw]

There have been so many studies of what, when, and how people eat that prove that most obese people (of course there are exceptions, I'm talking about the normative majority of people who weigh significantly more than is healthy for their frame and body type) actually eat less than their slimmer counterparts. There is such a thing as predisposition, and if you're born with it, you're condemned to fight it your whole life.

But people who have "thin genes" look at large people and see a lack of willpower, a lack of self-esteem, a lack of sufficient pride in one's self to maintain a healthy body. And of course standards of "healthy appearance" have grown ludicrous in their endorsement of vanishing percentages of body fat, visible muscle mass, and apparent bone and tendon. People with those sorts of body types are vaunted and praised right now, but most of them have done little or nothing to achieve them, just as I've done little or nothing to achieve resemblance to a bowling ball.

As far as scolding the writer and vilifying the magazine, all of that is generated interest and traffic, so in their eyes the article was a rousing success, as it has doubled or tripled their hit count.

::shrug:: We can't win, not as long as they're making the rules. We have to make up our own rules and play our own games, and let the skinny-obsessed preen and strut for each other and themselves.

Me, I'll cheer on your and anybody's efforts to improve your health and mobility, and expect the same from you and the rest of us oversized and large-hearted people.

((((you)))).

And some more *hugs*, just because.

[quiet000001.livejournal.com]

I just wanted to agree on the point of how much of it is just genetics. I mean, I am not exactly thin - I have that Viking/farmer build thing going on where if it were a couple hundred years ago and I had to spend hours every day shoveling snow so I could feed the animals or plow the fields myself, and then survive on the last remnants of dried fish and turnips, I'd be fine. (Well, assuming I got hungry enough to eat salt cod. Blech.)

But I also put muscle on like nobody's business - Nic's seen me in person when I've been doing a lot of lifting and carrying on a routine basis, she can totally vouch for me that I had Lance arms - muscle definition that some 'fitness' model types would KILL for, just from daily life - no concerted effort to bulk up, no special diet - my body just naturally put on muscle mass in such an amount and such a way that it showed to a point which most women would honestly really have to work (and possibly take steroids or something) to manage - because that's how my body works.

And it's pretty clear that it's a genetic thing, because my dad does EXACTLY the same thing - he gets more mass due to being male, but we both put on muscle and develop muscle definition at the drop of a hat. (We have the same skeletal build, too, which I imagine is not coincidental - I have broad shoulders and a fairly deep rib cage and my bones in general, going by lack of having ever broken anything, seem pretty dense - exactly the sort of bone structure you'd need to support large amounts of muscle.) (Once I went on an open day for a crew team thing when I was at uni in England, and one of the crew members was seriously practically drooling over the structure of my shoulders/upper body. It was kind of creepy.)

I'm not saying this to be all 'yay me' but rather to point out - if I made any kind of effort at all to actually try to build muscle mass intentionally, I'd probably have pretty quick results that were simply unrealistic for people without my genetic cocktail. And yet if I were, say, a fitness model (meaning those semi-attractive women with muscle tone who aren't total body builders, but are more buff than 'normal') people would be asking for my secrets - and the fitness and diet industry would be trying to sell them on the idea that they too could get the same results with X magic product - even though the 'magic' in this case is that I've got a certain combination of genes or whatever it is exactly that makes my body respond to exertion in a specific way.

I guess at some point they'll be trying to figure out how to bottle THAT, which is just creepy, but until that point - we're all going to look how we look. There's some 'wiggle' room in that - I'm not always all buffed up, for example, if I'm not using the muscle regularly - but it's not so much that you can reasonably change the basics of how your body wants to be. (I mean, my mom just does not put on muscle mass at ALL. When she broke her leg and had PT to help her use a wheelchair and crutches more effectively, it took them FOREVER to build up her upper body, because even with the best possible scenario, it's just not something her body wants to do. Her body does not want to be able to step in and plow the field, should the oxen be sick one day. It's designed to be good at something different.)

[fufaraw]

Oh yes, definitely, bodies are designed differently to be good at different things. I am dreadfully nearsighted and have always had loose joints that dislocate easily, thus preventing me from running very well. I was also fertile as a bunny and began menarche at ten. In anthropological terms, this makes me a valuable commodity: my ordinarily wide hips are meant for breeding and my loose joints make childbirth less stressful than females who are more tightly strung. I have little upper body strength to fight off suitors, and can't see well enough to run away. I also metabolise calories extremely slowly, so in times of famine I have larger than average reserves to draw on and can go longer without food to survive.

Unfortunately, the traits that made me a prize in prehistoric times are the exact ones that dispose me to packing on fat in the much more sedentary modern office-mass-transit-apartment life. ::shrug:: So I'm an anachronism. A chubby, tv-watching net-surfing displaced body type.

[rahaeli.livejournal.com]

I am dreadfully nearsighted and have always had loose joints that dislocate easily, thus preventing me from running very well.

Pardon me for butting in here, but have your doctors ever discussed Ehlers-Danlos Syndrome (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ehlers–Danlos_syndrome) with you? It's what I've got, and it's incredibly common and incredibly under-diagnosed. Just from that sentence, it sounds like you might have it too!